Consequences I need ideas for Consequences!!!
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
theknowles
My wife and I are going into our third month of being houseparents for teenage girls. The girls that we have range from ages 14-18 and can be quite difficult. Here where we are we use a level system to hold them accountable for their actions. To give you an example level one girls are not allowed to have any of their own belongings and are required to wear uniforms on all outings, as well as many other consequences. Whereas the other levels (2-4) are allowed certain privileges. Our level ones have recently started to revolt and not care what level they and have no motivation to move up to the next level, and they feel like they can do what they want when they want to. I need some ideas or consequences in dealing with them. Anyone have any interesting things that work.
Seamus
We use a similar level system it seems, but our level 1 does not seem to be quite a strict and we don’t have uniforms. This is coming from someone who doesn’t work where you are and I don’t know how much you can change things in your own home and what you have to run by your director and get approval for. I sounds as though level 1 seems very suffocating. My director (and I agree with him) feels that a kid has to have a light at the end of the tunnel. I understand that at level 2 you get privileges, but to a teenager (especially if they have ADD/ADHD) it’s hard to see how to get there. If you have no instant rewards for good behavior and they have to wait a week or 2 before moving up to the nest level, then is it really worth it to them? One thing I have learned is that even though they may still be on level 1, if they do something very well, then they need to be rewarded for that. For example, one of my boys got bumped down to level one a few weeks ago, and had no TV, computer, iPod, stereo, etc. However, one day, he had done very well at school and come home and did his homework and I let him play a game on the computer for 10 minutes. It was only 10 minutes, but it wet his tongue and made him want more. Therefore, the next day he worked even harder. However, if he were to slack off just a little, NO WAY.
I’m not in your home, so I don’t know what all is going on, but if a kid feels as though they can’t do anything right or even if they do they don’t get anything for it, then why do the right thing, you know? After all, it is kinda funny to see the hp get upset and frustrated – and I already have nothing, so what’s the big deal.
I would attempt to begin giving a little back and really rewarding the good behaviors (stay up 10 min later than the rest of the girls that night, 5 min of TV, change out of uniform for the night, etc.)
These are just suggestions, but again, I don’t know your campus, director, or how exactly things are done there. I may be way out in left field for you, but it sounds like they need to see a light at the end of the tunnel.
Launchpad
I totally agree with Seamus. It sounds like the girls need to get a little of something to keep them motivated and moving forward.
Hopefully your program and facility is flexible enough to find something that they are interested in achieving in the short term. As crazy as it sounds, some kids could care less about achieving a facilities’ pre-set goals. Especially if the kid never had any say in what it is they would like to achieve.
Personally I would be motivated to get to the next level to get all my stuff back, but for some kids they have a hard time actually seeing themselves achieving a goal beyond the end of the day, let alone next week. It can lead, for some, to a feeling of hopelessness. I think finding out what each individual girl would like to be rewarded with and setting short term goals for them to achieve may work.
theknowles
I just want to say thanks for the information. We know why we are here and it is not to punish the girls, and sometimes you get caught up in do this. I am glad for the info and that fact that I have never thought about why they didn’t care but it makes sense seeing as how most of our girls do have add adhd. I will surely take this and run with it, as much as I can. We are in a really good program and they allow us to make a lot of the decisions about rules( of course we do have a set book of guidelines). Thanks again for the feedback.
“The Safest Place is in the Center of God’s Will”
Karing4Kids
Sometimes we have to do something to give the kids hope. If they dig themselves a hole it can be hard to get out of. We have to let them smell a little bit of success from time to time. We have to dangle the carrot in front of them sometimes so they want to go for it. Who knows when it will be the time that they turn their life around and continue to want to be on a higher level.
Coach4HIM
If you have one or some who are misbehaving find out what they like to do. When they are not on level have the others do what they like to do and do not allow them to participate. This might mean that one of the houseparents stay back. For example we had a girl who really liked this part and to go down trails we made sure that when she was not on level that we went to the park. Another idea is movies. You can have show a movie like on the weekend and have the ones who are not on level to set in another room etc.
-Coach4HIM
MomforLife
I had two young men that did not ‘care’ about rising up thru the ranks. Life’s experiences for them had convinced them that it did no good to advance, because someone or something would always beat them back down. Nothing seemed to motivate them…UNTIL… we discovered their passion. Sometimes it is hard to see a child’s passion when they are conditioned to express nothing, but we were blessed. When we went the extra mile to provide an outlet for their passion (for one it was individual guitar lessons with a really good instructor), we found these two young men responding to us with real emotion (mostly positive). HOWEVER, we could not use these lessons as reward or consequences… that would have just shut the boys down again. For the one child – the lessons cost money, we worked with others to give him opportunities to earn his lessons. We had to use opportunities not connected to our house or regular chores, he worked for other people on the facility grounds. We kept the requirements very low, so that the boys could not fail. Within one month, the boys began to do better in school and at home, and we were able to build some relationship bonds that were healthy…it felt like a miracle.
bradykim
You just can’t keep giving negative consequences to these kids. Are you changing or modifying the behavior just giving out consequences. If one of your Natural children was in trouble you could give very harsh and long consequences and it would change their behavior. With the children we care for we can’t keep piling it on. They have to have hope. If we take privileges away they usually can earn some back. These kids have been through so much, it makes me laugh when I hear someone say they are going to break them. Most of my guys have been beaten, some with lamp cords and who know what else. Yet we think we can break them by taking stuff from them. Some people are motivated by the positive and some by the negative, you have to know what will work for each child. We use a chip system, some will cry if we take a chip some do no care, yet will respond when they earn chips. We made a modified family teaching model with the chips. Family teaching is 4 to 1 ratio positive to negative we used Family teaching in a DJJ home with teens most gang members, I thought it worked well and they teach don’t pile it on, give them a chance to earn something back. You also need the teaching part, they need to be taught correct behavior and rewarded when the do it.
Our Rad daughter was giving us problems we used love and logic all she had was a mattress on the floor. She said you did everything you can do I’m still going to do what I want. F YOU and walked out the door and we did not see her for weeks. That taught me that you need not only consequence but give positive reinforcement and bait them back.
webmaster
Every person I have ever known to live by the break-em philosophy is now doing something else for a living. Though the so called breaking of a child may work for the very few, it won’t work for the vast majority of children in placement. They have already been broken by their situation and have learned ways to cope and deal with it. They have to be taught that adults can be dependable, caring and respectful, that not every situation is bad.
I’ll be the first to admit that this is a very hard thing to do. It’s hard to be caring a respectful when you are being cussed at, yelled at, spit on, or disrespected, but it has to be done. Our daughter that we raised in placement and that chose us as her parents, put us through test after test after test to see if we would stick around and continue to care. We did and now she calls us mom and dad. But even if she had never decided to make us her parents, but only learned to be a productive member of society and how to treat others, it is worth it.
Craig Bridges
The other problem with the break them philosophy (control) is it is usually external and only works while when the kids are in the “break them” environment. It is a combination biblically of truth & grace. How does God deal with us? He tells us what or how we should do things, tells us the consequence of both obedience & disobedience, allows us to make a choice & experience the consequence of our choices. What I love is his blessings, mercy, & grace far outweigh the penalties. Also he is always there with open arms, willing to forgive & give us the support & love we need to get back on track.
We need negative consequences when raising our children but they should not be the focus. We should go out of our way to give grace, build relationships, find hot buttons (blessings) and have open arms. I don’t know about everyone else but I need Jesus because as the webmaster said it is hard when time and time again you are being disrespected, disobeyed and everything else. Thank you heavenly Father for your example on how to be a house parent.
A Valuable Lesson!!!
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
Most everyone knows that we have birth children to go with all our home children. Our son is about to turn 17 and this last year has been a trying experience. It is one thing when you have to deal with difficult behavior when you are caring for other people’s children, but it adds a whole new dimension when it is your own birth child. (Don’t misunderstand, it’s not get you placed in a group home bad behavior, but it is definitely stuff we hoped we wouldn’t have to deal with)
Anyway my wife takes things very personal sometimes and the other day she was asking me, why I thought he hated us and wanted to make things so difficult on us. I wasn’t sure how to answer it, and really didn’t think there was a good answer for her, but I started thinking about the many conversations we have had with him recently and remembered something he said. He told us something like, ” I know you think I don’t want to be around you at all, but I really just want to hang out with my friends.”
That got me to thinking about his overall behavior in general, and I think that statement can be applied to his entire life at the moment. It’s not that he don’t like us and wants to defy everything we say, it is that THE ONLY THING HE CARES ABOUT IS WHAT HE WANTS!
He doesn’t want to hurt us by hanging out with people we don’t approve of, our feelings are not even a consideration, because it is about what he wants. He doesn’t care that we think he should save some of his paycheck for the future, he only cares about what he can spend it on now. He doesn’t care that we think education is important and that you should put as much effort as you can into, he only cares about the work he doesn’t want to do.
The realization of this is very empowering. It allows you to recognize and deal with bad behavior without taking it personal, because it’s not about you. It’s totally about them; what they want and think is important. This same realization can apply to the work we do as houseparents. There always seems to be this one (or possibly two) kid(s) that seems to be out to get you or drive you nuts with their behavior. But if you realize it’s not about you, it should make it easier to deal with their behavior and to come up with reasonable expectations and consequences.
If only I can remember that the next time I’m dealing with my son, after he’s done something I am not real pleased with.
Dating in your home
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
dontlietokids.net
Do you allow your kids to bring their boyfriends or girlfriends into your home? I’ve met many house parents who are proud that a member of the opposite sex has NEVER entered their home.
This puzzles me. Have we never been teenagers before? Have we forgotten what dating was like? The house parents who don’t allow bf/gf to visit in their home always talk about raging hormones and such, but that’s exactly why I do allow my girls boyfriends to visit.
Now don’t get me wrong, I make them stay in a public place. I check on them frequently, and I always get to know the boy, telling them my expectations. I get involved with my girls relationships offering advice and opinion as much as possible.
Look, if you never allow your kids to date, if they can’t bring home this person they THINK they love, what do you think they will do? So often they will end up in the bushes somewhere. What’s more scary still is that you can set up a “Romeo and Juliet” relationship where the kids think “it’s us against the world” and then you’re asking for even bigger trouble.
I suggest the following.
1) Get to know the person your child likes.
2) Invite them over, talk to them, lay down ground rules.
3) Let the bf/gf know that you are involved in your kids lives and that can be good or bad for them, it’s up to them.
4) Talk frequently to your kids about why you do what you do and what you expect from them in return.
5) Supervise, interact, and walk around like a warden when the visits happen. I am very relational with my kids, but when their boyfriends visit I don’t care if I act like a prison guard (lol). I care about my kids too much to allow anything to happen, but I also care to much to ban bf’s from my house because I KNOW the result of that approach.
At least think about it..
webmaster
This may surprise some people considering the history I have with Adam but I 100% agree with him on this one.
In addition I would like to add that I feel much better when my son’s girlfriend is here than when he is out with her, because when they are here I know nothing inappropriate is happening. Same goes for kids I’ve had in the past and also in the future when our daughter and other children become old enough to be immune to cooties.
Launchpad
I know sooner or later I will be dealing with this issue. At present I have no kids that are at the dating stage, but we are getting close. It’s kinda one of those things Iv’e taken for granted. I really don’t even know our policy on it- but will be finding out shortly after seeing this post.
What are the limits of personal display of affection?
How do you handle (or do you) off campus dates, for example movies?
Just the nature of what we do, supervision has to be a constant. I am very curious as to how to effectively balance the supervision and personal space with teens that are at the next level of developing a healthy relationship with the opposite gender. I believe a lot of facilities choose to not even allow a dating relationship to happen because of the above mentioned concerns and the unmentioned but obvious sexual concerns.
dontlietokids.net
I let our girls sit with their boyfriends. I must be able to see their head and hands at all times.
I try and make other kids sit in the same room with them when at all possible. I often try and have double dates in the home, not just ONE couple in a room by themselves.
PDA can be no more than one arm around a shoulder or a head (high) on a shoulder. That’s it.
Off campus dates are granted based on trust, level of student (we have levels where I work that kids earn by behavior and attitude), and their willingness to allow me to know about their relationship and talk to me and or my wife about it.
Launchpad
Thanks!
I do like the level achievement systems. It really gives kids something to work towards and a little easier on staff discussions as to which kids qualify to do what without all the drama a treatment team can muster. Kind of makes me long for the ole’ Boys Town Achievement levels.
Cool topic- Looking forward to going back on shift and finding out where we stand on the dating issue.
Called2workwith youth
Have any of you had to deal with the kids that put on a real good facade of being good and trustworthy and all that, just to get on the highest level. Then once they do and get the privilege of going in town on a date, they get caught having sex and get dropped. That seemed to happen a lot at the place we worked at.
I agree teens should be allowed to date, but there should definitely be supervision.
When You’re off…..
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
momofmany
When you’re off duty for respite how does your house run? The same, better or worse. We just took time off with new relief people and our kids ran our house, and not in a good way. Any tips on how you handle this?
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TexPop
I’ve dealt with this too. It makes it almost more stressful to go off-duty than staying on. In our situation, our off-duty apartment is attached to the cottage – so we’re always here.
We’ve made a cottage handbook, specifically for the Relief Houseparents, which includes our rules and practices as well as a handbook on the kids so the Relief knows what to expect from each child. This also includes things like daily cottage routines and generally-used consequences. On our very first meeting with the Relief we reviewed this handbook at length.
If the problems observed don’t pertain to the health and well being of the kids then I wait until our “changeover meeting” to discuss it with the relief Houseparents. Make a list with specifics and review them in your meeting. There may be a need for a “shadowing” period so the Relief can understand what you mean. All in all, it will depend on the attitude and receptiveness of the Relief. I would definitely be prepared to raise the issue with the campus administrator if problems persist. This is another good reason to document specific examples.
Also, I tell the kids that I will continue to hold them responsible for following the well-known rules of the cottage – even though I may be off-duty.
-TexPop
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momofmany
The guys know we hold them accountable, it just seems this time they went wild. I don’t know what it was. The notes from the people covering were not good, which I have taken up with my supervisor. I know I am a control freak, and that does not help, but the house was a wreck, the kids were horrible. Everyone on campus knew what my kids had done and that we were off. I think that coming back on was the most frustrated I had been. Our apartment attaches to the house, but we had made a quick trip out of town. It has been hard just trying to get them back on track.
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Launchpad
Awesome tip with the cottage handbook Texpop!
If there has been serious problems with respite I have talked with the respite to find out what’s going on, (Maybe the kids are giving them an extra hard tim) try to resolve the issue and if that does not work, it’s time to take it up the chain with the supervisor for satisfaction.
I’m also a bit of a control freak so I’ve had to learn to just live with some stuff and recognize some people have different expectations. Just cause the cereal bowls ended up in the wrong cabinet does not mean I need to get ugly on the relief.
Kids (even your most trustworthy kid) will hustle any adult that is not with them full time. Kinda like substitute teacher day in school. A cottage handbook like Texpop is talking about should reduce much of the drama.
I use to really hate going on respite because it seemed like we had to start over from scratch every time we came back on. Anytime there is a flux in the schedule it sends a lot of kids into a tail spin. Unfortunately in this setting it is not possible for a facility to keep the same HP’s in the house 24- 7, 365 days a year without a break. So the house spinning up is going to be reality no matter what we do. The only thing we can do is try to minimize the spinning as much as possible. Set rules and very, well defined boundaries that are strictly followed by the respite help a great deal. If the respite is not willing to do that- It will be bad for everyone.
I have only worked with one lady that was absolutely horrible at being respite. Kids allowance came up missing and groceries would just vanish. She did not last long. Most of the respite couples I worked with were awesome. Glad I don’t live that life!
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webmaster
Relief is a necessary evil of residential childcare, which by the way I am very much enjoying at the moment, and will always cause some disruption with the children and staff when it happens. I used to be really uptight about everything being perfect with the kids and relief staff but have come to realize it’s not going to be.
I do however very much agree with Texpop that holding the children responsible for their behavior whether or not you are there goes a long way in helping the situation. Our kids know that if they try to manipulate the relief staff and do things they are not supposed to we will give them consequences on top of whatever relief staff gave them.
It’s also much better when you have consistent relief staff. Our kids don’t try to get over on regular relief staff near as much as they do, when we have vacation relief staff covering the cottage. I think familiarity with the children is one of the top stabilizing factors with the children. When relief staff knows the children and what the rules are things seem to go better.
You also have to consider the frequency that there seems to be chaos. Even with good relief staff, fair and consistent rules, and great relationships between the kids and staff, there are going to be those times when the kids seem to just flip out and that’s when you hammer them when you get back. Our kids seem to do it about once a year. If it’s happening every relief then there is probably a problem with staff (either you or relief), or the program.
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bakergirl
Our kids love testing relief. They will pull stuff that doesn’t even sound like them. It’s pretty sad. I just consistently tell them “we know what you did” and give consequences. I think it will eventually settle down when the relief has been here for awhile.
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Seamus
I know that everyone has complaints about relief – including myself – and how the house is messy when you come back and the kids are a struggle, but think about it from the kids perspective as well. When we are at the home, the kids feel safe, protected, and structured. Each of these is the EXACT OPPOSITE of the life that they have come from. Each of these kids have been abandoned, abused, left, ripped out of homes and thrown into new ones. They finally start letting their defenses down with us because we have provided a safe and structured home environment for them. They can learn to be the “responsible” kids that we see each day. Well, when we up and leave every month or two weeks or whatever our schedule is, it is just like when mom left or dad left or those foster parents they were with for two days that they were never able to trust and build a relationship with. OF COURSE all those old behaviors – that we don’t see anymore – start coming out again. It’s their way to cope – they are putting their defenses back up. This is especially true if the relief is inconsistent or constantly changing. Don’t get me wrong, I’m NOT excusing the behavior AT ALL. We do give consequences when we come back for things that might have happened, but ‘s sometimes good to think of it from the kids perspective as well.
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glidenhi
Well I guess I feel mostly for the kids, cause they are the ones that have multiple bosses. They are the ones that have to switch gears if there isn’t consistency. Have you ever worked in the business world and had two bosses who do things differently? I have…and it’s the pits!
I believe the secret to a wholesome household…be it a regular family or a group family….is unity among those that run the house. It is rare. Just like a wife and husband are one in marriage and better present a united front to the children; houseparents….all of the houseparents…had better be married in purpose and understand each other and come up with a compromise/unified plan that works for the household. The main houseparents should have an outline of each child’s character traits and strengths and weaknesses and a plan for building/redeeming each child with progress reporting. All other houseparents should add to and maintain the outline/plan/progress. Part of the completion of any stay at the house should be an update to the plan and a meeting in the changeover to assure that the plan is still unified and on track. If that takes meeting in the office on the morning of the changeover, then so be it.
Too often, I saw no plan and no unity and no coordination going on. I saw a lot of turf protection and keeping of secrets, though. I saw kids that were being punished for bad behavior with no explanation of how they could repair the confidence of the houseparents. They weren’t given satisfactory encouragement when they demonstrated the type of behavior that would lead to their redemption. As a result, kids that already had little hope of being well thought of would despair quickly. I believe that a clear visible path to redemption with help and encouragement along the way is the only thing that will bring hope and results. In my opinion, duplication of punishment by houseparents just destroys credibility for the other houseparents.
I’ve seen what happens when kids have to make changeover under those circumstances…..after being full of life and joy, …..about an hour before the changeover, ….they would all go quietly into the living room and sit down and become silent. As you would go in to bid them goodbye, they would be as stiff as a board and not even respond. How could you not have compassion for them.
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JonNDeb
At times we hate to get off. we only ask to have off one weekend out of the month. As we like to stay on duty. and in our home. as that is what it is and every time we leave it is like leaving our home, bed, stuff… etc. The Kids will always try to play the houseparents for the weekend. Getting away with anything and everything. We have just gotten a family who fills in when we are away once a month we have started to trust and enjoy and fill better with leaving and knowing that the house will not be burned down when we get back. We still have a few days when we get back getting the kids back on track but things are getting better.
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missy
Sometimes I wish I had not even taken off because it takes DAYS to get the house back to “normal”. Please pray for our new respite; there fruit isn’t producing a good crop.
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Karing4Kids
It’s pretty much a given fact that it’s going to happen. Sometimes the kids do things just to see how we react. Usually after a couple of days things return to normal and then you can start worrying about the next time your going to be off. I’ve worked with good relief and also with the bad. I’ve found that if you try not to make too big of a deal out of it the kids seem to do better. Try to find something good that the relief did and praise them for that. Don’t let the kids know your feelings or they will play them like a cheap banjo! Hang in there and try enjoy your time off. If you’re worrying while you’re gone then you’re not really getting the rest that you need.
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missy
It really isn’t the kids, it’s the house. Everything is moved, including our stuff on the computer being deleted. Our ministry only allows Christian music, which our boys love & our respite is listening to 80′s heavy metal & even told our kids that’s what we had the radio on but, they knew better. 30 minutes after we leave the petty cash is spent on food that they, not the kids, like. They also live close by & I don’t think they even go to church. They have stated they would never be full time houseparents but are respite for 2 homes with 12 + days off a month. Please pray for all of us.
Suicide Watch
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
momofmany
Have you ever had a kid in your care on “Suicide watch”? What preventive measures do you take? Any idea on the best way to talk with them? Any help would be appreciated.
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webmaster
In all the facilities that we have worked at, we did not do “Suicide watches.” If they threatened suicide or we suspected it was a possibility, they would be taken to the emergency room and evaluated by a mental health professional. If needed they were admitted and watched by the hospital or mental health facility.
If they were just manipulating they came back and in most cases never tried that again.
I am thankful for having administrators that are aggressive in dealing with that.
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TexPop
I’d have to agree with WM on how we handle suspected suicide “attempters” at our facility too. I HAVE had times when I needed to keep a close watch on kids because of other behavior issues. In these cases, we’d do an intensive room sweep and then remove the bedroom door (they could change cothes in the bathroom).
What kind of measures are you having to take? Is this normal at your facility? Is there training provided?
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momofmany
I don’t think it happens too often, it is just one of those where the ER does not think they need further psych eval, however, the facility is more cautious. I have wonderful support. We keep them line of sight AT ALL TIMES. We often times get “Night Coverage” so that we do not have to be awake all night. I think my facility has some of the best training out there, and luckily our supervisors are available by hand held radio. I have dealt with a lot of abused kids, but it seems that three times in the last three months I have had one with suicidal ideation. Our bedrooms don’t have doors, so that is not an issue. Almost everything is taken away during these times and we do a lot of talking with the resident. It just breaks my heart that this is the thought of a teenager.
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Launchpad
The first facility we worked in was a much higher care facility. When/ if the kid made a suicide gesture or statement we would call the therapist or ambulance (Depending on how serious the attempt was). The therapist would make a decision on whether the kid needed to be placed back to the children’s psych ward (Where most came from to our facility).
IF the kid came back- Any objects that could cause harm where taken out, which meant more or less everything. Given enough time to think about it, you can kill yourself with pert near anything. Over night staff would keep watch on the kid.
I have never had to deal with a suicide attempt since I got married and my wife and I moved to another facility. Since then, suicide statements that kids have made would be reported, we would talk to the kid briefly but we also don’t make a big deal about it. Most of the time it is a negative attention seeking thing and the more emotional you get the more adventurous they get.
In the public
September 20, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
sonshine_mom
I just wanted to know if anyone else deals with their kids in the public, i.e., schools, etc.
Our program is more of a foster home-type setting. These kids go to public school (not a very good public school), are able to go to friend’s houses and spend the night, able to go on outings by themselves, etc. They have A LOT of freedoms. This proves very difficult in keeping outside influences from filtering in. Each day it seems like we have to remind them of their language and their attitude. Each day we argue with them about the privileges “regular” families have (like cell phones, etc.). It is a battle.
One of our kids absolutely does not want to be in this program so he is protesting by not eating anything in the home. He does not eat lunch at school and then does not eat breakfast and maybe only eats a few bites for supper because he does not want ANYTHING from our program. He protests about not being able to have his own money to carry around on him or have cell phones; definitely feels entitlement and thinks he’s better than the others in the program. I feel he needs humbled pretty bad–LOL. The other kids in the home do not like him because of his behaviors toward the houseparents and to peers. He has a bad choice of friends at school and brings home this bad attitude. He is 16 so, you know, he thinks he should have all the freedoms of an adult! LOL. It’s just so frustrating as a houseparent to have this many outside influences.
We will be dropping the bomb to him tonight and his privileges probably over the next week will be null due to his behavior. He does not want to sign forms to be in the program (which require his signature) AND last night we caught him throwing out clothes that our facility bought him (luckily we dug them out of the trash and saved them). Like I said, it will be like jail for him over the next week due to his behavior.
Do you guys have any similar problems?
Thx!
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webmaster
We work in a residential foster care home and the children we have the most difficulty getting adapted to living in our home are the ones that come when they are older. For the majority of the older kids they have had little or no supervision prior to coming to live with us and find it very difficult adapting to the structure. On top of that they attract to the very same kind of kids at school, so they believe that all kids are just allowed to do whatever they please, to go where they wish, anytime they wish.
They don’t understand that in normal families, there is structure and boundaries, and have a hard time adapting to it. What makes it easier, is having a good sponsor program, where they can spend time with families in the community that are stable so they can see there are families that have structure and boundaries.
My personal feelings are that facilities that are more foster care than they are therapeutic need to make provisions for the kids to be able to earn money, be able to carry money, and use their money even on things like cell phones. In our facility all our older kids are allowed to have money, and once they are in high school can get prepaid cell phones provided they are responsible with them. I think foster care facilities need to provide for the normal things of life as much as possible to include things like Internet access, phones, outings, dates, school sports, etc.
As for your 16 year old, be patient. I think I would use some serious restrictions like you describe. He will eventually get hungry enough to eat, and will run out of other things to wear and start to settle in, or do something bad enough to be sent home or somewhere else or possibly run away, which result in the same thing. Either way it will get easier.
Frustration (Taking Behaviors Personally)
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
theknowles
Wow, what a week. I thought that I could not become anymore frustrated about some of the girls in my house, and then Friday arrived. My wife and I have been doing this for 3 months, and I was loving it until this week. I am feeling completely squashed by one of the girls, I will call her “Drama Queen”.
Drama Queen and I have about the same personality, except for the fact that she does not care what she says or when she says it, and I am having a really hard time holding back. Yesterday it seemed as though I was put down so much by her that she just knew that it was getting to me, and it did about 8 o’clock. I let her have it and then felt totally terrible about how I reacted. I am really feeling frustrated about the situation and feel helpless. I have been spending time in God’s Word and trying to seek his guidance. Lately I feel like there is a wall up between me and God, and I know that it is me and my attitude. I just need a way to release the resentment.
They say that you cannot take what they say and do personally, but it is extremely hard for me because I am the person that feels I need everyone to like me. Monday we are planning on going home to see our families and I know that it will help to see some people whom I know love me and care about me “I cannot wait”. I know that there are many of you out there that have been doing this for quite some time, and if you can offer any advice I am all for it.
Launchpad
I can’t even begin to tell you how many times I have said something stupid and/ or inappropriate to a kid. I remember one teen boy that told my wife he hoped our unborn daughter would die and fall out. The rest of my interaction with him looked more like a conversation between Tony Soprano and somebody he was getting ready to shoot. That was the last big blow up I had.
We work in a highly emotional environment. Most of these kids could not handle foster placement because of emotional and behavioral issues, so they get placed with us in group homes. In reality almost all group homes are “behavior Modification” facilities, whether they think they are or not. We try to teach and empower these kids to make better decisions and create healthy relationships.
My patience and reactions have gotten better over time. There’s a lot to be said for experience and the fact that after being called a B***h for the millionth time it actually starts to become hysterical and you find yourself teaching to the behaviors, not reacting out of anger or frustration. But it still happens- at least to me.
I think everyone has a certain boundary that is not to be crossed. When you have a 14 year old not only cross that line, but doing with a sneer and taunting you, it’s only natural to imagine you spanking them out by the wood pile. Just don’t do it.
All the rules and regulations that are in place are there because we are only human. The child care industry is in a much better place now than it was as little as 20 years ago when de-escalation at some places consisted of a leather belt or wooden paddle and a good swinging arm.
As for the wall between you and God- I find myself there often. I start feeling like that when I don’t have a solution as to how to deal with a kid or I feel like I’m making no difference at all. I pray, jump on the motorcycle for a few miles and go talk to some of the guys I trust here and unload on them. It helps- at least for me.
glidenhi
It is one thing to be offended by a resident…..it is another to watch one undermine your credibility with the other residents and feel powerless. You may be running into a former houseparent’s neglect. For some it is easier to let a strong anti-leader run the house and reward them with special privileges in return for conditional allegiance. That results in losing credibility with the whole house anyway, and leaves a “lord of the flies” survival of the fittest…. game player mentality. That will work ….although pitifully at best…..for “keeping” kids, but it won’t work for redeeming them.
Take the kid aside and get real with them. If putting you down continues…just remember…you probably aren’t the only one being put down. Make her pay consequences for putting anybody down. Find out if you have offended her….if she has a legitimate beef, ask forgiveness and fix it. …..but don’t let it continue. You have to have control of the house…otherwise…the whole house suffers…and the children have no security under your leadership.
You ultimately have to have the support and the confidence of the director. Sometimes kids do better with one houseparent over another. Sometimes they do better in another type of setting. The director can make changes if they are needed. If they don’t want to be bothered when a destructive situation can’t be resolved at the house level….which should be rare…..it’s time to move on.
Finally starting a home-questions on younger kids
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
bakergirl
Well, the day has finally come. We are beginning visits with a boy that may become our first kid. We’ve been doing relief while waiting for our house to be finished and now its finally done. We were trained for teenagers and cut our teeth on them too. Now it looks like we will be starting our home with a 5 year old. Although I’m used to little kids, its different when you are hping them. Any advice?
What do you do when a 5 year old tantrums in the store? I assume you take them to the car until they either calm down or you have to leave but what if they are flailing uncontrollably? Its just so different with teens. The worst thing our girls ever did was beg for favorite food! I know I got spoiled doing relief for our relatively stable girls (although it didn’t feel like I was being spoiled at the time)
What about attachment issues? My little goddaughter started calling me mommy when I kept her for very long so this worries me a little.
Launchpad
Does your facility run TCI, CPI, TFM or another program?
Are there any written guidelines in regard the children’s consequences/ behaviors?
I know a lot of others here will disagree with me, but as far as attachment goes- It’s a good thing. If they want to call you mom and the facility does not mind- I say go for it. Sometimes they need that. The attachment is what makes them feel like there is someone that loves them.
As for tantrums in public places? Get ready for it. I’ve had more dirty looks at the mall from people who thought I should be spanking my six year old who is cursing while I’m leading him out to the van for a time out than I care to think about.
A good program, clear and well established boundaries and lots of patience will help when dealing with the younger kids. Actually I’ve worked mostly with teens, but now that I’m in a elementary cottage I enjoy them more. It’s more work, but it seems like we have more genuine moments with them. I also don’t have to worry about them running an underground tobacco smuggling operation.
Webmaster
QUOTE
What do you do when a 5 year old tantrums in the store? I assume you take them to the car until they either calm down or you have to leave but what if they are flailing uncontrollably? Its just so different with teens. The worst thing our girls ever did was beg for favorite food! I know I got spoiled doing relief for our relatively stable girls (although it didn’t feel like I was being spoiled at the time)
You are correct about going to the car. Lead them out by the hand if they will let you or pick them up and carry them out. If they are too big to carry and have tantrum issues you don’t take them to the store until you have had sufficient time to work with them in other situations to reduce or hopefully alleviate their tantrums. Make sure that as you lead them or carry them from the store that you don’t strike them, shake them or grab them in a way that can appear abusive (hair, ears, collars, etc.) and remain calm.
QUOTE
What about attachment issues? My little goddaughter started calling me mommy when I kept her for very long so this worries me a little.
The children I work with are very long term kids that could spend their entire childhood with us. Some of them call us mom and dad and we may be the only mom or dad they ever know. We do however have many discussions with them about birth mom & dad and foster mom & dad; that we are here to care for them and love them because their birth parents are not able to.
Our facility allows us and the children to do this, but I know of several facilities that don’t allow the children to call you mom and dad. When we were foster parents, our state regulations prohibited the children calling us mom and dad. You need to find out what your facility’s policy is and follow it. There are some ways to avoid the mom and dad name issue and still be personal. We have had older couples that had the children call them mamaw and papaw. We have a housemom that goes by Aunt Becky. I have known several housedads that go by pop or pops.
bakergirl
wow, ok. Thanks for the replies, that helps a lot. I was worried about picking them up but that makes the most sense. My director even said to let them tantrum on the floor but I was worried about them destroying things. I think I like the idea of waiting to take them to the store until we’ve spent time together and tested out other outings. We were going to start with an open area such as a park, then work slowly up to grocery stores and restaurants. You know, McDonalds before Lubys kind of a deal.
The first pre-placement visit went well. I’m really confused about the family situation. I can’t tell what is “wrong” with this kid. I’m sure there will be a brief honeymoon period but that doesn’t last as long with little kids as with teens right?
Launchpad, I think I really enjoy working with the little ones too. They are so honest. They just talk to you. Its very obvious what the sensitive issues are…they aren’t afraid to talk (if they are comfortable with you). This kid adored my husband. It was so funny because he wanted to be with both of us at the same time. If dh wandered off to do something, it only took a few minutes before he asked where dh was. I can tell that if we take him, he is going to break my heart. Since we have been doing relief, I’ve been able to keep the relationship on a relational but definitely more of an aunt and uncle level. A little one living with us all the time will definitely change that.
Change of topic- what do y’all think about taking elementary age kids off of meds for add/adhd for the summer? I’ve heard theories that since they don’t have to do schoolwork in summer, they should be off of them.
webmaster
We almost always take our kids off of ADD medications during the summer, with Doctor’s permission of course. They don’t need to concentrate as much, and hyperness doesn’t bother us that much. School starts in 4 weeks and we have a child that is trying meds for the first time. He is the most hyper child I have ever met, it will interesting to see how they work. We got the Rx today and will start him right away to see how the meds affect him. The first day of school is not the time to try new meds if you don’t have to; there are too many things that can go wrong.
TexPop
QUOTE
The first pre-placement visit went well. I’m really confused about the family situation. I can’t tell what is “wrong” with this kid…….. I can tell that if we take him, he is going to break my heart. Since we have been doing relief, I’ve been able to keep the relationship on a relational but definitely more of an aunt and uncle level. A little one living with us all the time will definitely change that.
My wife and I have a house of little boys, now 6yrs – 12yrs old. Prior to taking this cottage, we relieved in teen boy and girls cottages. We’ve found that most of the time what’s “wrong” with the little kids are that those caring for him are totally incapable of doing it (i.e. jail, drugs, health, etc.) These little guys just need love and structure. We’ve traded the self-sufficiency and “attitudes” of teenagers for the hugs and tears of little ones. Yes, it is more physical work – laundry, dressing, baths, cleaning – but they’ve got our hearts and it’s a pleasure and honor to be the ones who get to teach them all the basics of life.
The heartbreaks are different too. Like when they go on “Home visit” and come back to the cottage not understanding why they can’t be with their family and then cry themselves to sleep because they miss their mom. But, I’ve gotten to teach them how to ride bikes, tie their shoes, make their beds, catch a ball, and pray to God. HOW COOL IS THAT?!!
We wouldn’t have it any other way!
Consequences for Smoking
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
momofmany
Do you have any special consequences you give for smoking?? We have tried different things but
TexPop
Is the smoking occurring at school or home, or elsewhere? Is there some person that instigating, condoning, or facilitating the behavior?
I admit, I’ve not had to deal with this particular issue. I’ll be interested in how others have handled it.
momofmany
Smoking was at home. One person is the leader and the others follow along. The leader is the one who has obtained the contraband (both cigarettes and dip) from someone else on campus. Our consequences have to be respectful, reasonable and related. We have had them in the past make a nice donation to the American Cancer Society, which usually works. I don’t think it will work on this kid though.
Launchpad
We have a younger cottage now so we don’t deal with it. BEFORE though I felt like the DEA running operations in Columbia.
Some kids the consequences work. I have discovered that there are some kids who will not quit. I don’t care what the consequence or how severe the punishment will be, they will not quit. In the past it has became a power struggle between me and the kid.
What can you do? Nothing. You will not stop them from getting the tobacco. In fact the more you struggle with them and increase the consequences, the worse and more defiant they will become.
IMO- Sit down with your team, come up with what you all believe is an effective response cost for any tobacco use and stick with it. Being consistent and fair with everyone will probably produce more positive results than always increasing consequences, becoming emotionally charged and/ or threatening a kid.
In the past I had a teen that we constantly worked on. Daily room searches, chore consequences and threats. More than once admin threatened to throw the kid out if he did not quit. He only escalated in use, brought more tobacco into the facility and encouraged more kids to use. It became a power struggle between him and the system!!!
I look back on it now and realize we did more to push the kid away than we did to help him. Telling him he had to go if he did not quit was kind of the equivalent of telling your Grandpa he was no longer a part of the family because he smoked a pack of Camels. I wonder how many of us would tell our own Bio kids the same thing? How many of us HP’s are struggling/ have struggled with tobacco? We sometimes need to remember our own journey. Definitely not a shining moment in my HP career.
There are also lots of Tobacco cessation classes in the community and Quit Coaches. I have seen some success with kids that went through some of those classes.
My biggest issue with tobacco was the underground network kids would create. Somewhere on the forum I asked for help with where all they could hide their stash. Very informative! After reading all the suggestions of where to look I found a lot of stuff. I was able to put a crimp in the black market activities.
Good Luck!!!
webmaster
Launchpad, let me start by saying, “I missed ya MAN!!” I find your topics and replies so insightful. You make my job real easy, because your advice is usually better than mine. You usually say what I want to say, only better. Welcome Back!!!
I agree with you about the tobacco. Some kids will never quit, and it will always be a struggle. For some kids, their smoking becomes one of the most important things in their lives, and if they can drive somebody else nuts with it all the better.
The only way to change behavior is to find something they would rather do or something that they value more that can be taken away if they don’t stop. (I realize there is the whole God thing with changing behavior, but in a worldly sense there is really only the two options)
I have a 17 yr old birth son that decided he wanted to smoke like all the kids (which by the way I don’t approve of, but have found it difficult to stop him from seeing) he hangs out with , it wasn’t until I promised to cut him off financially (no vehicle, car insurance, cell phone, lunch money, etc.), unless he quits smoking. I told him if he wanted to smoke, he was going to have to pay for it completely. I wasn’t going to subsidize it by providing a vehicle to drive, an affordable cell phone, and lunch money to buy them with. If he could afford to provide all those things himself and still had money left over to buy cigarettes, I figured it must be a real priority. So far it seems to be working, I haven’t found any cigs in two days.
BTW – I must say I enjoy the look on his face when he sees me crushing an almost full pack of $4 cigarettes.
Cigarettes Need some suggestions
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
Launchpad
Here’s the deal. I have a kid who has been out foxing me on hiding contraband. He smokes and dips when he gets the chance (mostly at school, I think), and is very, very good at hiding his habit. Most of the time he gets caught at school smoking. Other times we catch other kids and their response is usually they get their stash from him.
I am certain he has a stash very close to the house. His room belongings and person are searched daily at varying times. My wife and I have discussed several Black ops type of scenarios to find his little treasure trove. We know he is smoking at school and at certain times when he manages to disappear for a few minutes around the house, usually while me and my wife are dealing with another kid. He is constantly on restriction and has no access to his allowance, yet he seems to be getting supplied from somewhere at school.
The main thing perplexing me is we never smell smoke on him. Not on his fingers or clothes. Being a former chain smoker in my mis-spent youth I have found this a very difficult thing to accomplish smoking without the smell of cigarettes on your clothing. This kid is good.
What is he using to cover the smell? Any idea how I can put a crimp in his black market activities. He obviously has no desire to change. I do hope to find a way he will not drag some of the other boys down his road. Any suggestions?
webmaster
Favorite outdoor hiding places I have seen are:
- Inside the van
- In the mail box
- Under a board or cinder block in the yard
- In the eaves of an outbuilding
Favorite on person hiding places I have seen is:
- In their socks
- Hollowed out soles in shoes(under the insoles)
- In their underwear
- Pens with insides removed
The sneakiest kids I have known always hide their stash in public places, sometimes right under your nose. Check in the crevices deep inside the couch or a chair. In seldom used cabinets or end tables. We had a boy that hid his cigarettes in a little curio cabinet we had on the wall by the front door. He hid them there for over a year before we discovered them.
If he doesn’t have smoke on his fingers, he is using some sort of holder like a clip or tubing. It is probably hidden with his stash.
It sounds like individual consequences are NOT a big deal with him, so you may try group consequences. Even those that aren’t smoking with him, probably know where his stash is. Some group consequence like cancelling fun activities out of a lack of trust for the group, might encourage others to at least, in confidence, give up his stash and there will be a few less cigarettes in the world.
Always check with your administration before using group consequences and if they don’t produce results fairly quickly stop using them. You don’t want to create a situation that could result in the boy being abused by the other boys.
You also may have to accept that he may never change. He will either get good enough at hiding or abstaining to complete the program, will blow out of the placement, or forever live with the consequences of smoking and getting caught.
Just try to always be fair and to build a relationship with him, it may have a bigger effect than anything else.
Launchpad
Thank you! I never even considered some of those hiding places (Pen, shoes). My wife and I did a search and came up with nothing. We then decided to go with the group consequence. We sat the boys down and explained if one of them was caught or suspected of smoking or any other tobacco use, all of them would earn a workday for every incident.
Twenty minutes later I had three lighters, 4 cigarettes and an empty can of snuff. Every kid except for the one I have been dealing with gave up all locations of known or suspected hiding places and are watching the other boy like a hawk. Of course the other boy is spitting mad. Nothing beats peer encouragement.
Awesome suggestions! It has already made a difference in the house over the last few days.
Thanks again!
Bully’s, thugs, etc… Got one of these?
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
Launchpad
Ok- I’m at a loss on this one.
We have a kid that is just downright mean towards others. He is small and a little awkward and definitely not the tough guy type, but he is constantly going after all the other kids. The bigger the better! He kicks, hits and screams when he gets a hold of another kid. Oddly- the other kids never hit back, even at school.
I had the same issue once before at another facility. The other kids told me they thought he was crazy and bit “special” which is why they never retaliated. I suspect the same thing may be going on here.
This boy is in first grade. We work the point structure with him, but he really does not comprehend that points equal privileges.
Looking for anything that will help him to stop seeking death by peer relationships. He is currently doing about 50mg of Strattera a day. Any ideas?
momofmany
How does he feel when he gets the points? If it is negative, then you have to break the conflict cycle. Maybe the only way he knows to seek attention is negative behavior, and this could stem from before he came in your care. I would try rewarding positive behavior and see if that makes a difference. As young as he is, it will probably have to be really simple. If he can get through the morning, make it a small reward. Same for the afternoon. If he gets through the day, give me something bigger (a pack of skittles or M&Ms). It could also be that something from the past is triggering his behavior.
Good luck, I know it is not easy.
Launchpad
Good luck, I know it is not easy.
Thanks mom. The candy reward has really helped. Still having episodes but he is trying much harder to strive for the candy at the end of the day.
Great advice that seems to have hit the mark.
bakergirl
Our 6 yr old can’t function on a level system. We do use a token system to earn allowance but that alone is not enough. We have had a similar problem although not to that extreme. We realized that he was getting physical from the sheer need of physical touch. Now we try to give him tons of hugs, sit close to read a book to him etc. That really brought down the aggression. It seems polar opposite of what he needs but they can’t tell you what they need, they just go from instinct. We also will take away whatever toy or privilege he is interested at the time. Bad behavior, lose a puzzle or basketball etc. We do use candy or dessert as an incentive to eat his meals. I’ve noticed with this young of an age, you have to change tactics. One day taking a puzzle won’t bother him, the next day its enough to bring out a good attitude the rest of the day. Good luck!
Borrowing
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
TexPop
My wife and I are trying to get a better control on the kids borrowing stuff from each other. We’re talking toys and electronics mostly as we have young boys in the cottage. We generally don’t have a problem with borrowing if they’ve received permission from the owner – we have been also been requiring that they get our permission. The problem is that we don’t want to have to give our permission for every little matchbox car they happen to swap for an hour – they’re not going to remember to do it anyway.
Any ideas?
Launchpad
We have had the boys do contracts in the past. Lately we have had a no trading, borrowing, lending policy in place. Mainly because we were being overwhelmed with all the contracts and back room deals the kids were making. It was like watching stockbrokers work the boards on Wall Street.
webmaster
We also have young children (ages 4-11), our policy is that borrowing is not allowed period!!! If they are playing together they can share toys and stuff, but the child that owns the toys must be present when they (the toys) are being played with. And because all our children know that borrowing is not allowed, the child playing with the other persons toys will receive the consequences, and if we know that the other child loaned it willingly we will take it up for a period of time.
We have never allowed sharing clothes regardless of the age; it just caused too many hassles.
We have found that loaning and borrowing is just too hard to police. If a child has something that belongs to somebody else it is impossible to tell who is telling the truth when one says, “he loaned it to me” and the other say, “I did not, he took it”
TexPop
Thanks WM, I think we’ll be trying your method. -TexPop
Discipline (Spanking)
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
(Christian Themed Discussion)
ItsSteve
Hi everyone,
My wife and I are Christian and raised our children biblically. Including on occasion the rod of correction (spanking). My wife wants us to become house parents. I realize that if we decide to do this that the children will not be ours and we will not be able to care for them as if they were our own, however I feel strongly that spanking is a very important tool in an adult’s arsenal when dealing with inappropriate behavior, disrespect, etc… and that’s it’s a mandate from GOD. So I am struggling with this. Also I am looking for a program that is more for children who cannot find a home, and not a facility for juvenile delinquents. I feel we have a lot of love to give and a lot of experience and educational background. I have been praying about being house parents and I feel this may be a calling. We are new to this any help would be appreciated.
God Bless, Steven and Jennifer Roberts
housepop
My wife and I have been houseparents for 1 year. Our greatest struggle is the fact we can not paddle the children (as instructed in the word of God), especially the toddlers. We have been blessed in seeing many positive changes in the short time we have been allowed to work with children. It is sooo hard to ask God for direction and help when you know you are not allowed to do as He instructs. There have been unpleasant episodes that would have never developed or escalated into a crisis if we would have been able to apply proper punishment at the proper time. We work at a Christian home, but everyone seems to give in to the ways of the world in this issue. It all boils down to the fact that I know this is God’s calling on my life at this time. I had to be obedient to his call and now depend on Him to see me through….I pray that he will lead me to a place that allows us to follow his word or give me the means to help the home change policy to HIS WAYS…..
Remain in prayer and be obedient to Gods direction in your life…..God Bless!
Max
Houseparenting isn’t for people who paddle, whip or otherwise physically discipline children. Many of these kids have suffered horrible abuse and need to be taught other ways of discipline. Spanking may remind them too much of where they used to be. At that point you become, in the eyes of the child, no better than the ones before.
The bible has more to say on discipline than “spare the rod, spoil the child.”
Look at the passages on how you should treat those who have been afflicted or harmed in the past. You will see my point then.
If you rely on the paddle with your biological children then houseparenting isn’t for you.
Gracecountry62
As far as I see God has not taken it out of His word though man has yes kids may have been whipped beyond what they should have been done but there is a big huge difference in a spanking with a paddle and a beating with a stick the reason that the State removed paddling from the Foster care program and Child care facilities is because there has been a lot of physical abuse done and people called it discipline or spanking but is really Abuse. Now we had 2 case workers for the Child Protective Services in the State of Texas agreed that yes a lot of kids need a good paddling but the line was drawn when abuse got out of hand at one time it was allowed but then ruled out. These case workers also told us that they spanked their own kids but said that Child care workers need to refrain from it they were not against it just said that everyone needed to follow the rules. This conversation came up when some house parents approached them and asked for their honest opinion they were taking chances for their thoughts on the subject but proceeded with what they said.
We do need to refrain from spanking don’t even think about it even though you may spank your own kids you cannot spank those in your care.
But the secular government if you may knows better than God and i disagree with Max ones who paddle their own children should and need to become House parents it does not affect on them wanting to allow Christ to love those kids through themselves I know of a great number of House Parents who spank their own kids and are very compassionate people. I thought God calls people into the Ministry of Child Care Max not man.
Grace and Peace
I don’t think paddling a diaper with one’s bare hand is bad, but once they reach kindergarten they shouldn’t be spanked.
See what Dr. Johnson at www.family-rules.com thinks.
His book is great and he’s a great Christian man.
Gracecountry62
No problem with most of what you said but hey i got a better book that you should read and that is God’s word He created mankind and has the best tool for discipline it is called spanking i think i will stick to what God has to say concerning spanking than what Man thinks we should do. Because most dismiss paddling though man changes God does not change His word.
These children entrusted to our care are not OUR children and PUNISHMENT is not a part of what they are meant to experience in our care.
I haven’t seen much new in the recent years that God has chosen to share with us. Just different interpretations by MAN of the bible to justify his opinions on any given subject.
10Yr VeteranHP
There will always be this debate in Childcare. What you must consider now in becoming a houseparent is “Can I do this without corporal punishment”. Today’s standards are much different than yester years. As time has gone by more and more “psychologists” have stepped in bringing in new theories on how to raise a child. Their approach is more therapeutic and is more based on communication.
The days of the paddle and corporal punishment are dying out, that’s just the facts.
I am not saying it’s right that this is happening it’s just the way it is in today’s society.
I myself do believe there is a time and a place for corporal punishment, and have been sad to see it being totally removed. It like all the other training you receive is a good tool to have in your box, and should be used when the situation is appropriate for it.
Not all children in care have been abused physically. A higher majority have been verbally or mentally abused.
Our view of Punishment and the child is much different, and that issue gets twisted more and more each year.
Punishment is a consequence without meaning, discipline means a consequence with teaching added.
You see there will always be a consequence out there, it is simply how the consequence is handled that can determine if it was used as a punishment or as a discipline.
It doesn’t matter if you give a child a time out or if you paddle them, if you do it appropriately and if there is a lesson learned from them. Otherwise if there is no lesson to learn you have a punishment, and the child learns nothing.
God has in fact given us many tools to work with children and the use of corporal punishment needs to be held back as a last resort option, when the other tools have not worked and it is deemed necessary by more than just one adult that has lost their composure. It should be a team decision, and should be supervised. I would also state that if you have to give more than “2 swats” your defeating your purpose. If 2 doesn’t have an effect more won’t either.
I also don’t totally agree with the person who said by 2 or 3 you won’t need the paddle any more, it’s more like if you have done it right hopefully you won’t need to used it by the time they reach their early teens. I know if my parents had not used it I would not be as nice a person as I am today. If all they did was talk and give me timeouts, I would have been as disrespectful as the children I see day to day now as a houseparent.
We are here for the children, this is not an easy job as some might have people believe. Houseparents have the most challenging job in childcare because they deal with the children directly, as well as answering up to administration for their actions.
If your looking to be a houseparent get ready for the hardest job you’ll ever love.
These children are going to find every weakness you never thought you had and they are going to expose that weakness. Your buttons will be found and pushed. You need to get prepared ahead of time mentally.
I have toured many people thru houses, and frankly they haven’t had a clue as to what childcare is all about. They don’t get all the facts from office personnel, usually what they get is how nice the children are and how wonderful things are. “Look at the campus, look at the nice children” etc…etc.
This is not a realistic view, and because of this approach I have seen many good people that could have been good houseparents quit and leave because it wasn’t what they expected.
Sure there will be good times during childcare, but mind you the rewards are few and far between. You will not receive a lot of feedback, but you certainly will know if you messed up.
Also, keep in mind usually it’s not the children that are the “straw that breaks the camel’s back” it’s the lack of understanding and support showed and given to the houseparents from the Office. Many times the office personnel have not clue 1 as to the day to day running’s of a home. All they know is what they receive on paper. Many have never lived in a home nor dealt with the children in care on a 24 hour basis. All Office personnel need a taste of this. So you don’t get a comment like this we received once ” I don’t know how you can deal with that child, I sure couldn’t if he was in my house”. Now this is not an isolated incident, this came from an administrator with 20+ yrs experience as an administrator. Believe it or not we also had a similar response years later with another supervisor who had 9 years experience.
I have even been called out to deal with a child by an office person because they just didn’t know what to do with a child. Mind you they had all the training the houseparents had.
With all that said, corporal punishment is disappearing more and more each year, if you’re totally hung up on using the paddle, childcare of today is not for you.
Boundaries for todays child in care
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
HP11thYearVeteran
Today’s child care is very different from years past. Some things set by state standards today though are just not right at all.
Here in Texas as the new standards have come into play there is really nothing that can be done to a child to stop his behavior unless he/she becomes violent or destroys too much property. As it stands currently if you have a child who decides one day I’m not doing anything I am suppose to do, even if they carry this out more than one day. You cannot do anything to change this behavior. If the child will not follow directions verbally your simply out of luck unless they actually become a danger to themselves or others.
Example: “I’m not going to school today” if they mean it well you are out of luck there is no danger involved and nothing can be done about it so the child gets a free day off, now while this child decides to stay home he may want to roam the campus, as long as he/she does not become a danger you can do nothing but keep an eye on them.
Yes this is really happening. As long as the child is no danger to themselves or others and is not damaging too much property, Houseparents you are out of luck especially if the child decides I don’t want to talk or listen.
This may sound ridiculous but it is true. Standards will not even allow you to escort a child with this behavior to another location.
Yes there is a major flaw in the system and yes there is potential for total chaos.
This part of today’s system needs to be addressed and a change needs to be made.
Administrators say we are now working better with children getting into their head and this will make the child better.
The system justifies it by saying we are empowering the children to make their own decisions, this is bologna, the system is overpowering the children, it allows them to do what they want, and does not make them responsible for their actions. We are not doing these children a true service to make them better citizens.
I am not at all saying we need to start spanking or restraining but I am saying something needs to change.
An early prediction: If things don’t change we better start paying more taxes for jails because these children will only find boundaries once the cuffs are placed on their wrists.
Whose children do you really think are in childcare? A majority of the children are in care because their parents didn’t have boundaries and still don’t. They either don’t want or cannot handle their children. The majority don’t try to better themselves, some continue to do jail time, or drugs, or other various illegal or immoral things. Rather than work towards making a home for their children.
It’s really sad that in houseparenting you can say there is job security, because that also means their will always be kids in care.
The bounds need to be set better for the children of today and the state needs to take notice of this if they truly care about the future of the kids of today.
Tuxedo
I also live in Texas, we have a young man now 16 who will not go to class during lunch. He takes all three lunches. The school however, is escorting him to all his classes, we now have the option to put him in a contained classroom for lunch. He is very easy going, does not disobey at home, always does as he is told and obeys rules, except school. We do have support however from the school.
CaringCouple
I find far more methods available to Teachers and Staff in the School System than those available to us in Childcare.
We work in a total “Hands Off” facility for example and cannot touch a child for any reason. But in the schools kids are regular “escorted” from place to place and restrained when necessary.
Coming to a “Hands Off” facility was at first something of concern especially since many of the kids that come into our care are from the streets and gangs of Los Angeles.
But for 8 months now there has not been a single incident where putting hands on one of these kids was necessary.
We also empower our kids in this program to make choices. However we also readily explain the reality of those choices and provide consequences to them when they make improper choices.
The behavior modification system we utilize in our Group Homes is Life Space Crisis Intervention. http://www.air.org/cecp/interact/authoronl…e/april98/1.htm
Even if you use other systems it never hurts to have additional tools at your disposal.
No More Corporal Punishment
September 19, 2009 by Webmaster · Leave a Comment
prsthelrd
We have recently went from using spanking as a form a discipline for our younger children to not being able to use it at all. It is too long to go completely into detail. My question is though, we have several children that have lived with the previous policy since and received swats as a “final” straw. They knew when they were spanked that was it. We now are no longer spanking and the girls behaviors are getting to where they act like oh well a time out is no big deal. Does anyone have suggestions of consequences that are at the level of a spanking that you know ok I did it? I was out of line. I am tired of hitting me head on the wall
CaringCouple
I spanked my kids a time or two over the years. If I think my grandkids need a swat I might deliver one.
I would have never thought I would experience some of the behaviors I have witnessed in these last few years or the physical aggression shown from some of these kids towards each other,
18 months ago we started here in a facility with a total “Hands Off Policy”. Laying a hand on a child here in any way could get you terminated rapidly. Even pulling one kid off of another during a fight is grounds for dismissal.
My wife and I have been trained in 3 different styles of verbal and non verbal crisis interventions and could certainly restrain or escort a child in an approved manner but have never found the need to lay a hand on a child in our care.
What may be a swat to you could be a reminder of an incredibly traumatic event that child experienced at the hands of an abusive parent.
That hug you give a kid that you care about could trigger memories of sexual abuse she suffered before coming to you.
We’ve learned this and so much more that I could have never believed 3 years ago.
You know your relationship with your own birth child and corporal punishment you deal to your own can have an effect that is understandable and controllable.
But to lay your hands on a child not yours that is in your care is such a cruel and uncaring thing to do in my opinion. I know you mean no ill will but none of us can possibly know the effects that “swat” really has.
prsthelrd
I respect your opinion and all, however this is a Long term facility and we are dealing with young children that have lived here since they were as young as 6 months old. We have raised these kids for the last 4 years. they came as part of sibling groups. We have older children that have not been “touched” since they have been here. I know all about issues following kids in care this is not my first rodeo. I am simply saying these younger children have been taught a certain way and now things are different and they don’t get it. I am not trying nor wanting to change a policy back. I need new advice.
CaringCouple
You have to find and gain control over the things that matter to them.
Whether it is their telephone, television, personal stereo, free time or private time…. you need to identify something that matters and take control of it from them.
You attach the behavior to the privilege and create tangible goals for them to attain to get the privilege.
If you cannot identify a privilege that matters you need to create a desire in them for something they have not had before.
Sometimes through additional interaction with other kids in the house while excluding the offending child.
Sometimes the answer lies not in you or the child but in their peers.
webmaster
Discipline is best learned when it models reality.
At your job, if you work hard, learn new skills, treat people with respect, and do what the boss tells you to, you get pay raises and promotions. If you do bad work, don’t show up, are impossible to get along with you get fired and have no money.
If you manage your money you get to have things like a house, a car, and other nice things. If you don’t the repo man comes.
If you behave in society, obey the laws and respect others, in America you get to be free and decide where you live, when to come and go, you get to vote, and do other things. If you don’t, you get to live in a small cell or have the privilege of wearing a very attractive plastic ankle bracelet that chafes.
When dealing with behaviors there has to be a combination of positive consequences for positive choices and actions, and negative consequences for negative choices and actions. Always look for the positive and when you see it, make sure the youth knows you see it. Give them encouragement, compliments, or a special reward.
Do not ignore negative behavior. For every choice there is a consequence either good or bad. For bad choices there needs to be bad consequences. Restriction, loss of privileges, group exclusion, loss of possessions, etc.
Exception: Opportunities to teach grace and compassion should be used. If a person never receives grace they are unable to give grace because they don’t know what grace is.
There are several tools available for teaching discipline. Behavioral charts, although a lot of work, work very well in many cases. The fear of losing something is usually greater than the fear of not receiving something. Taking things away for negative behavior works well until there becomes nothing more to take. If the child has nothing less to take, obviously that is not effective and something else needs to be tried, and the kid needs some of his/her stuff back. The need to belong is a very strong need so group exclusion can be effective, however detached children will probably not respond well to it.
Non-physical consequences are very labor intensive regardless of what method you use, so be prepared to put in some hours. However, they are usually more effective in the end. Why is it, that older kids prefer spankings at school? Because it is quick and the pain only lasts a few minutes. An hour of detention or a day in ISD (or in our case Restriction or time out) hurts them in their social life. Though it may cost you an hour or day also to insure they follow through on their consequence.
george
QUOTE
Children respond better to encouragement of their strengths than corporal punishment or withholding possessions or privileges.
We are not training seals, we are charged with the profound responsibility of developing human beings.
Giving false praise or focusing only on the strengths teaches a false reality and encourages entitlement and self centeredness.
In the real world, outside of academia, you only receive praise for your accomplishments, and there are definite consequences for negative behavior, either natural or imposed by society.